that this transcends libtard versus repukelican talking points. But I agree with you that what we think doesn't matter, at least for now.
Maybe in the past I felt Mandy had used me but not anymore. I never felt anything but respect for Aaron. We are polar for political views but both believe this is about free speech and the right to be left alone from a madman trying to get us imprisoned.
Patterico is my least favourite of the three, but he is the one who actually understands the meta part of it. First time I heard of him was well before this. I recall it had to do with his website covering the Leopold "Karl Rove Indicted" hoax.
It's easy to go libtard versus repukelican. We have all done that. Perhaps you were the first to stop and come up with the libtard and repukelican schtick. I wasn't really in your milieu 'til going to DKos in early 2009.
I'm grateful the three others can see how VR is lefty in only terms of a brand strategy.
It's fairly remarkable how this thing has exploded, no pun intended. Aaron came out with his thingie. Then MeSoc's old buddy Lee Stranahan successfully launched the Everyboody BK Blahg Day. The only one missing is Noom, which is ironic, because Aaron Worthington and Dustin Flanders are the Noomies of the right. He could have pulled an Other McCain and easily inserted himself into the top of the zeigeist. You snooooze you loooose.
I came out with my best tweet yesterday or the day before. Some Breitbartian claimed the NBC Today Show was interested, though I've seen no confirmation of that. Anyway, I said something to the effect that I've always had a huge crush on Katie Couric's legs. Of course I included her tweet address in the tweetage. Yes, I am keeping my eye on the potential big prize. Some leg.
I could go either way thinking maybe this will hit the big time or maybe it will peeter out.
If it comes to fruitionosity, I figure my chances for success will be 50-50. I'll either freeze in the camera lights, or sparkle on my way to becoming a national icon. [0op:)>
I wouldn't place any bets. Only thing we know for sure is that the Streisand Effect is for real. Oh yeah, before I forget. Sure I saw that article. I even tweeted the dummy who wrote it. And I tweeted Malkin a similar message. Basically that their narratives are off, since I was the first to scoop nearly two years before the others and the first to be sued and uhm, I am a lefty. But don't let the truth get in the way of a self-serving narrative. And yes, I read Ron's epic meltdown. That was probably the 197th time he has warned someone not to release an email with the opposite taking place.
by: socrates @ Sun May 27, 2012 at 07:53:02 AM UTC
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You wish is my command,
Troll Wars, Part VI is up at My FDL.
You'll recognise the classic socratic dialogue format
Hi Seth,
I'm sorry for what has been happening to you.
I hope that you will find some support from your friends on the left in addition to us evil right wing bloggers. So far, I have only seen a few articles from the left mentioning BK at all, and they appear to be either defending the guy or acting as if the people who are trying to stop him are all donning foil hats or something.
I prefer the term "Retardican" for my stupid party, by the way.
Guess I'll answer in order.
Donkeytale, I've tracked down my one email from Ron Kimbrynauser. I'll add that to your thread as an exclusive.
Dustin, the Flanders thing was donkeytale's coining. He thinks you're the banality of evil like Ned Flanders. Or he'll find a way to back out of having said that.
Well, as for Mandy and Patterico, it's simple. I cannot not like Mandy, no matter what's gone down. It falls under the principle of shit happens.
I recently had a flare up with FilmLadd. It was our egos clashing. Noodles negotiated a settlement. There was no blackmail.
Patterico, I mean, all he had to do was make a phone call and put my plane ticket on his credit card. But he said no. So from then on I didn't exactly like him. It was a $400 ticket. I had a hundred on me. Mandy offered a hundred. I had two hundred coming in soon, so he would've been paid back.
Mostly I hate people like Popehat and even Marc Randazza or any others out there who could've but haven't gotten me a pro bono lawyer. I have tons of Rauhauser emails never read in my email box, and of course some with attachments, and it's just vile cyberstalking to go with his cybersmearing. Then there's the fact we now know he and Kimberlin are associates, or I believe that came out. I mean this is an open and shut case if someone could get off their ass and help me. I don't hate anyone. I don't think I even hate Kimberlin. This is history. Us nobodies are brushing up to history.
Fricken then McCain shows up acting like look at me so scared have to go on the run, donate now! If anyone is gonna get killed, I'm pretty sure it's me.
And since Patterico is a prosecutor, no way in hell as a leftier than thou can I like him. That being said I do like him. Ugh. Aaron is one funny cat. Calls me sir. Told me of all his liberal friends from up north when he studied here.
Which takes me to Zilla. People just trash talking on the net. Some of it's really stupid and boring. Other times it's fun. But when push comes to shove, if talking politics is gonna give one an ulcer or disrupt the game on tv, then people just need to stifle it.
The problem with this story is that the three amigos are cheaters. They can't take geting their asses beat fair and square. They have to cybersmear, file false claims, try to ruin people. The kids call it the shit just got real or something.
I know there are some Republicans and Libertarians I can agree with on lots of stuff. Say like free speech. Or a lot of them will be anti-war. They realise we have to save those for Hitler. And I pissed off Mandy's boyfriend because I had the gall to find a link showing more money is spent on the military industrial complex than social welfare. Or FilmLadd got mad at me because I had the gall to point out Republicans fricken invented dirty politics. Going after Clinton for an affair, but GW Bush got no heat for an illegal war? Even Papa Bush and the old school Republicans were holding their noses for that one. Unless that was an act, and we gonna talk Bilderbergs, Alex Jones and whatnot.
Correction. Mandy and Patrick both offered $100. I had $200 coming in soon. They were thinking paypal. I was thinking the flight is in four hours. So I needed someone to cough up a credit card. I had gone into a shell. I was never handed a writ of summons, so I never thought itt was legit. Patrick did his best to try to wake me up. I did finally obviously. Made some lemonade out of lemons I guess.
Crossposted from Troll Wars Part VI
I’d rather ignore them. They are acting more trollish than us on our worst day. They could easily hit a link or two. I find that a common waste of time post is when someone generically asks for a synopsis. Even when the nooks and crannies are easily accessible.
Firedoglake is a good blog to get search results. I think it’s best we discuss and/or add links and whatnot like you did. If anyone asks or adds anything relevant, then fine.
I’m listening to Patterico on Stranahan’s radio show. The dude from RedState while not being swatted had police showing up to his house cause someone called in a fake report of an accidental shooting.
Donkeytale, I don’t know about you, but I find the recent “blogburst” totally surprising. I never expected that type of eruption, even if it has come from the far right-o-sphere. Not saying it’s gonna lead to normal media coverage. I’d be happy if simply the Maryland legal system arrested and prosecuted the asshole for trying to get Aaron sent to the clink for 10-20 years or whatever that bogus assault charge would have brought about if convicted.
Man, I felt vindicated when Mandy did her piece October 2010. This blows that out of a High School parking lot. Ugh, tthat’s not something to joke about, especially on Memorial Day. I think anything less than psycho returning to prison happening then this is all just a blip like you surmise.
A pretty big blip. I’d say this should be bigger than the Leopold hoax which made national news. It’s definitely bigger than Kos’ townhouse memos. But it will only truly be up there for a story when Wolf Blitzer covers it.
Though I’ve been off of television for a while and am not sure if Wolfie is still around.
This would have been a good one for Donahue to report. It needs a liberal media slant to give it more credibility.
I mean, the truth of it is stunning. I know you think it’s wrong to suppose Ron might of done the swattings, correct me if I’m wrong. I think the swats of Pat and Mike were clearing done by Team Numbnuts. And then the theory of why comes down to two possiblities, imho. Maybe an off-kilter wannabe journalist wanted to hype a story to promote himself. The Stranahan supposition. Or my theory is that Numbnuts wanted to terrify the relatively low number of people looking into the Weinergate aftermath. Since somehow my schtick got tied into it, and now we know Rau and BK are associates, then think of the thought of motive for the bombings. To clog up a small police dept. investigating the Scyphers murder. Sounds irrational but easy to argue as truth. Then look at Ron’s irrational posting patterns the last year. I kind of think Patterico nailed this story.
I edited Troll Wars 6 down to the essential links in case there is some newbie who might wish to learn about this saga. Doubt if thats the case at My Fascist Defense League, but you never know. Our brilliant dialogue simply got in the way and it does look yecch-y to the naked eye.
My mea culpa is simply that I wanted to get something up on the latest chapters (story not over, of course, like a good soap opera only will end when the actors die, hopefully of natural causes in ripe old age) without having to to spend any more time besides cutting/pasting.
So, our original dialogue is now available only on Pffugeecamp here:
http://www.pffugeecamp.com/showComment.do?commentId=24301
I know ours is important commentary because we discuss the way the meme is changed and exploited by the rightwing media into "all lefties are or support/sympthasize with terrorists" when actually the reality is most lefties are simply follow the herd mentalities, who cant handle anything that doesnt match their preconceived notions of what cyber reality should be. AKA living inside the bubble of blogging conformity. My guess is, your amigos excluded, most of the minour league bloggers on the right operate from similarly limited perspectives.
The exploitation would be the same, IMHO, if the progressive media glommed onto a story that makes the righwting look bad. Its happened before and the same exploitation and changing of the meme occurs everytime. Its what happens in the media. The various levels have different relationships to power and so use the story for different ends. I suppose I could write some brilliant analysis if I had more spare time, which is in short suplly these days. I'd like to see you do it, from a social theory perspectives but you are too emotionally and egoistically involved, so I cant expect you to see to distance yourself enought to be dispassionately analytical.
But it is important for me to point out here that I am not throwing Ron Brynaert under the bus. Call me old fashioned, but the evidence is not persuasive enough at this stage to engage in counter cyber smearing.
I'm yet to be fully convinced that the swatting of Patterico even occurred, although I could be persuaded if some tangible evidence were put forth from someone other than Patterico. Maybe its out there because I dont follow his blog or many others on the right, except when directed specifically.
Did I coin this phrase, or subconsciously steal it from somewhere else:
"I’m suffering from a rare disease commonly known as Brynaertia, whose main symptom is the inability to do anything except compulsively follow Ron Brynaert’s twitter feed."
That was an excellent analysis, donkeytale.
This is the problem from our side of it. You and myself another time have pointed out that firedoglake is simply not gonna get much action. My Left Wing is dead, and I am perhaps the only blogger in MeSoc herstory to be perma-banned.
Pffugee Camp is on fumes. It's been years since Political Flesh Feast has been around. Huffington Post is too spread out and doesn't even have forums.
The two biggest lefty ones where this should be discussed are Daily Kos and Democratic Underground. But herstory has shown those two to be controlled Gestapo style by Team Numbnuts.
Basically, there is nowhere except here or on your Troll Wars masterpieces to put political bias to the side and as a lefty say this is fried because of such and such and etc. and henceforth et al.
Patterico's place is doing a splendid job. I've gotten to know a few of them. Dustin does socratisation from the right. SarahWW is another one in that category. Noodles, what a great name, perhaps he is the donkeytale of the right. I'm impressed with this Zilla kid above. There's nothing like some self-deprecation. Hope I got that word correct not sure.
My fear notheless is that if I hadn't been the one setting off the story, then Patterico's would now appear no different than the Malkin's and Beck's. As in look at the right being abused by the left.
And then like you say, the details would have become lost in lieu of pointed narrative attacks on Barbara Streisand, Soros and other liberals who support terrorism.
I've requested Lee Stranahan put me on his radio show. I am ready to join the -frey- fray. Not because of my ego needing a boost. But just to give my side of things while showing I'm actually a nice regular guy in real life.
Today I'm also gonna stop off at the local police station and warn them hey you might get a fake 9/11 call on me.
Maybe I'll try to write something up like you suggest. It hit me yesterday you are correct I am too invested and emotionally involved.
I'm gonna try my best to chill from here on out.
A strange fact came out of the Patterico on Stranahan Show. Mike made his first post at Patterico's in October 2010, on a BK related post no less. What are the odds?
Patterico and Stranahan think it was a coincidence, but I am not so sure. It's like with Brynaert, the things I was trying to get through to you. Why on earth has he been protecting Kimberlin while smearing myself and the others? How come Mike and Ron are now buddies? How come Stack has also been protecting BK and even said he doesn't care about the legal woes of folks like Aaron? Then he went out of his way to smear me simply for mentioning he was into porn and was doing that censoring. Very fishy.
I think what's needed is a real life law enforcement investigation into VR and JTM, not just the tax forms, but a looksie into specifics such as receipts, contractors, expenditures, etc.. What myself and TLNL sensed wasn't rocket science. Hoaxes + donations = fraud.
Well, the heart of conspiracy theory is applying logical seeming supposition to tie coincidences together into a neat package.
Just because you can make logical suppositions or a series of them even, doesn't necessarily mean you are speaking truth.
I see this occurring regularly on both sides of the great whiteyspheric divide.
Mostly, I believe that "voice recognition analysis" is about as scientific as lie detectors or arson investigative techniques....iow, they are not scientifically credible at all.
I'm rather surprised that the Asst DA of LA County would stick his neck out this far on something so flimsy....so flimsy in fact that the police themselves won't touch his case, even though from 9 to 5 they play on the same team.
If I were you, I'd put my personal animosity towards Brynaert aside and refrain from commenting on his "alleged" involvement in the swattings until you have much more seriously compromising evidence to indict him.
This isnt about Brynaert specifically for me, whether he did it or not. This is basic criminal justice schtick. And I'm not going to hang anybody, even Hitler, on Voice recognition technology alone.
I've seen people in Texas wrongly put to death due to flawed non-scientific methods that are accepted in court simply because "its the way things are done."
DNA evidence can easily be hoaxed. (SEE PD, Houston DNA fraud, for details) Arson investigation evidence was found -- by real scientific research when it was finally applied-- to be not only flawed but the direct cause of suspects being punished and put to death, as well as used to get witnesses to change their memories and even their attitudes towards defendants. (SEE Willingham, Casey, New Yorker Magazine).
Voice recognition is highly contestavble (SEE Martin, Trayvon)
Here is a Guardian article on VRA: they say it's relationship to science is about same as astrology and its accuracy is no better than the result you would obtain from flipping a coin.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/blog/2009/mar/12/voice-risk-analysis-lie-detection-benefits-government-results
Mainly, I'm glad the Police acted with enough restraint not to off anybody in 100s of swattings that have occurred, and I'm glad they are aware enough not to rely on this schlock science to indict suspected perps.
Here is commentary on VRA regarding Trayvon Martin case:
http://techcitement.com/hardware/cries-for-help-voice-recognition-analysis-in-trayvon-martin-case/#.T8Obh9VYt5c
"Voice authentication is best done with as many potential matches as possible saying the same words. In this case, where the voice could belong to either Trayvon or Zimmerman, identification is limited to matching the voice against Zimmerman and against other random samples. While there is some technology that tries to match voices based on frequencies in the speaker’s voice, this is best accomplished with a large pool of material to work with.
Assume for the moment that the voice on the tape is Zimmerman. Voice authentication is done in two primary ways: an audio forensic specialist listens to voice samples and attempts to find a match or a digital machine compares the biometrics of the voice. Zimmerman would supply a recording of himself, and that would be matched against random samples of other voices saying the same words. The extra voices would be in the mix to help the analyst avoid making a match due to subconscious bias. Zimmerman could also supply a longer sample for voiceprinting, but even in this best case scenario it may be hard to make the match.
Now, assume that the voice was Trayvon’s. Audio forensics are best matched when the same voice says the same word under the same circumstances on a good recording; background voices on a 911 cellphone call are pretty low quality. Even if Trayvon’s family has recordings of him speaking and even if they have recordings of him saying the word help, there’s a good chance that the samples would not sound alike.
The big question is whether audio forensics are admissible in a court of law. Voice matching claims to be as accurate as fingerprinting when under the right circumstances*. Fingerprint expert testimony is admissible in a court of law, but like voice recognition, the standards can greatly differ. Fingerprints samples are often not perfect, like voice samples, and analysts look for points that match. Until recently, the UK required 16 points that match, but the U.S. doesn’t have that high a standard. Factor in that every analyst may see a match differently, as in this Washington Post story from 2004:
Three highly skilled FBI fingerprint experts declared this year that Oregon lawyer Brandon Mayfield’s fingerprint matched a partial print found on a bag in Madrid that contained explosive detonators. U.S. officials called it “absolutely incontrovertible” and a “bingo match.” Mayfield was promptly taken into custody as a material witness. Last week the FBI admitted that it goofed; the print actually belongs to Ouhnane Daoud, an Algerian. … In Mayfield’s case, the FBI located 15 points of similarity, places where the particular ridge characteristics of two prints “matched.” Even the Spanish authorities, though doubtful about the match, identified eight points of similarity. While many American examiners no longer exclusively count points, experts have declared positive fingerprint matches in court after finding even fewer than eight points.
It remains to be seen whether audio forensic experts believe that they can conclusively match Zimmerman’s voice to the recordings. The state and the Department of Justice may conduct their own separate analyses, and they may not come to the same conclusion. The technology has progressed, but it’s far from perfect."
I am agreeing with you the voice recognition thingamahooey isn't or shouldn't be sufficient to convict anyone. Otherwise the Rich Littles of the world could spoof others to take the fall for hypothetical crimes, much like swat hackers manipulate phone numbers.
Nonetheless, the record shows Ronny Boy is up to his neck in awkward contradictions. While the voice recognition expert's findings won't be sufficient to have him charged, such analysis whether legitimate or not could sway a judge or jury in a civil court when combined with other circumstantial evidence.
Like others, I agree this is a story still in progress.
I am now in contact with my local police. Strangely enough or not, they are more aware of blogging dynamics and the specifics of this story than Triple F ever was.
How about this. Putting proven perjury to the side, is there any reason why BK hasn't been arrested and/or charged for making a false criminal report against Aaron?
When I skimmed the above posts and saw Trayvon Martin's name, I was like wtf. But I do see your point. And there might be something else to take from that other case. Zimmerman wasn't charged right away. It seemed to take public outcry to get the prosecutors off their arses. Hopefully the Maryland prosecutors and FBI (for the cyber harassment) get off theirs too and put a stop to the disgusting crimes perpetrated by Team Numbnuts.
And keep those donations flowing, der volks...
"During the recorded conversations, Zimmerman and his wife discussed what they should do with $135 posted to his Paypal account by internet supporters at his website. In fact, they were speaking in code because the true amount was $135,000 which they subsequently transferred into their bank account."
http://my.firedoglake.com/mason/2012/06/01/zimmerman-bond-revoked/
I'm not gonna read the link, but just imagine all the money being taken in by Patterico and that right wing blogger defense fund. Kerchinnng! All I want is a little bit of pro bono help. If one in Massachusetts or even Maryland wants a cupcake win, there's tons of evidence to find a guilty verdict for a lawsuit against Team Numbnuts. It's shocking there hasn't been an arrest yet. That's got to be the next step. And oh yeah, I want acknowledgement it was my scoop. This was my life's big work. Maybe not much, but I did it. It's like Lt. Dan in Forest Gump. I don't want my destiny stolen.
Here is my prediction: Zimmie cops a plea, gets two years reduced by time served, reduced further by good behaviour and does about 9 months, is released, allowed to move out of state to take a job, keeps all or most of the $135K (or wtf it grows to in the interim, since he pleaded guilty he only needed a lawyer to negotiate the terms of his sentencing).
Then he moves to NY and joins Judge Napoleono (or WTF) on Fox News for a regular show about how bullies and vigilantes are the great white hope for saving the "Republic" from kids who look like they could be Obama's son.
The first episode: how crowd sourcing brought a gang of domestic cyber LEFTWING terrorists led by the villainous Brett Kimberlin to their knees.
I think you're onto something. The right-o-sphere is a pack of hypocrites.
If what you're saying is true, one of their own killed a kid and made a buck 35 off it, er uhm ugh $135,000.
Negotiations with Patwick Fwey have hit a snag. Little baby prosecutor has his feewings hurht I called him a pig. If he didn't smear me and told the truth, I wouldn't have had to say that. As I explained to him. I'm a lefty. We don't like or trust cops. Don't tase me, bro.
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